Puppy See, Puppy Do-Do

On March 31st, nominations for both the 2016 Hugo Awards and the 1941 Retro Hugo Awards will close.

Sad Puppies IV attempted to turn their slate into a “recommendation” list this year by opening up suggestions on a dedicated page (those participating made their suggestions in the comments) and then offering to whittle the list down to ten or so finalist recommendations, that puppies were then encouraged to consider for their ballots.

Kate Paulk recently closed the comments (at the beginning of March) so that they could be compiled and a final list composed.

It’s a little late in the game, especially considering that nominators are kinda expected to read and be familiar with works they’re going to recommend (but that isn’t necessarily an impediment for organized voting), so we’ve decided to help them out a bit and give them a hand up.

We started with one of the most visible categories – Best Novel. The following list contains all of the individual works mentioned in the comments. We did not verify eligibility (although most, if not all of the works seems to meet that criteria). When judging whether or not someone recommended something, we took “Plus 1” and “Me Too” to count for a “vote”. If someone talked about a work but didn’t expressly indicate that it was something they were going to nominate, we didn’t count it.

If a “top ten” is going to be compiled, it’s pretty obvious from the counts below what we should see on the Sad Puppy IV Slate. It will be interesting to see how the final list compares.

Of particular note is Honor At Stake by Declan Finn. He wasn’t shy at all about recommending his own work and apparently working the room works! Honor came in at #2. Funny how the same thing that was done to the Hugos last year popped up in SPIV, huh?

There were some 356 comments over all.  Patterns are sometimes obvious:  whenever someone mentioned a previously unmentioned work, it was usually followed by a handful of “me too” comments.

Maybe there’s a reason this compiling has waited so long.  Maybe (off-chance), Kate decided that if it came in too late for the majority of works to be read, the claim could be made that SPIV didn’t really influence anything.  Maybe.

The process was relatively straight-forward:  individual works were added to a list and then each individual mention of a work that met the above criteria was counted as a vote.

There was a lot of discussion of nominating series; these were included.

I don’t understand the need to compile a top ten:  we’ve already got the “recommended reads” part done.

Nevertheless, here it is.  It will be interesting to what, if anything makes it to the final ballot.

1SomewitherWright23
2Honor At StakeFinn22
3Aeronaut’s Windlass, theButcher19
4UprootedNovik19
5Long Time Until Now, AWilliamson16
6SevenevesStephenson15
7NetherealNeimeier13
8Son of the Black Sword, theCorreia11
9Fifth Season, theJemsin8
10Strands of SorrowRingo8
11Ancillary MercyLeckie7
12Just City, theWalton7
13Desert and the Blade, theStirling6
14Saturn RunSandford/Ctein6
15AuroraRobinson5
16Devil’s Only Friend, theWells5
17Golden SonBrown5
18Harry Potter and the Methods of RationalityYudlowsky5
19Raising CaineGannon5
20Dark Tide Rising SeriesRingo4
21Discworld SeriesPratchett4
22FirefightSanderson4
23Hell’s Foundation QuiverWeber4
24Net of Dawn and Bones, AChancy4
25Ronin GamesHarmon4
26Sorcerer to the CrownCho4
271636: The Cardinal VirtuesFlint/Hunt3
28Black WolvesElliott3
29BlackbirdBoykin3
30Dark Forest, theLiu3
31Fool’s QuestHobb3
32Nemesis GamesCorey3
33Shepherd’s Crown, thePratchett3
34TorchshipGallagher3
35Ancillary SwordLeckie2
36Angels of AttackKloos2
37Anniversary Day SagaRusch2
38ArchangelReed2
39Autumn Republic, theMcClellan2
40Black Fleet TrilogyDalzelle2
41Bones and AllDe Angelis2
42Call To Arms, AZahn/Pope/Weber2
43Children of TimeTchaikovsky2
44Collisions of the DamnedYoung2
45Darker Shade of Magic, ASchwab2
46DistopiaKroese2
47Dragon ThiefSwann2
48Futuristic Violence and Fancy SuitsWong2
49Foxglove SummerAaronovitch2
50Her Brother’s KeeperKupari2
51House of Shattered Wings, thede Bodard2
52Library at Mount Char, theHawkins2
53Mechanical, theTregellis2
54Traitor Baru Cormorant, theDickinson2
55VermillionTanzer2
56Werewolf CopKlavan2
57A Succession of Bad DaysSaunders1
58Alex Crow, theSmith1
59AliceHenry1
60Architect of AeonsWright1
61ArmadaKline1
62Ashes BornLowell1
63Awesome, theDarrows1
64Book of Lost Doors, theBurnett1
65Borrowed Man, AWolfe1
66Buried Giant, theIshiguro1
67Byrony and RosesKingfisher1
68Castaway PlanetSpoor/Flint1
69Cat at Bay, ABoykin1
70ChaplewoodPriest1
71Cinder Spires, theButcher1
72Clockwork LivesAnderson1
73Culmanic PartsSutcliffe1
74Cunning BloodDuntemann1
75Dark IntelligenceAsher1
76Dark OrbitGilman1
77Dinosaur LordsMilan1
78Dread Wyrm, theCameron1
79Echopes of ApolloThompson1
80Edge of DarkCooper1
81FlexSteinmetz1
82GatefatherCard1
83Gentleman Joe and the Red QueenBujold1
84Grace of KingsLiu1
85Greek KeySpangler1
86Half a WarAbercrombie1
87Hidden Masters of Marandur and the Assassins of AltisCampbell1
88IlluminaeKaufman1
89Invisiblew Library, theCogman1
90Karen MemoryBear1
91Knight’s Shadowde Castelle1
92Less Than HeroBrowne1
93Liar’s Key, theLawrence1
94Last Song Before NightMyer11
95Life and DeathMeyer1
96Long Way to a Small, Angry PlanetChambers1
97Lost Fleet: Beyond the Frontier: LeviathanCampbell1
98Mind Over AllFabian1
99MorteRepino1
100Oncoming Storm, theNuttall1
101One Year AfterForstchen1
102OracleWest1
103OriginatorShepherd1
104PactWildbow1
105Philosopher Kings, theWalton1
106Predator OneMayberry1
107Providence of Fire, theStaveley1
108RadianceValente1
109RadiomenLerman1
110Retrieval Artist seriesRusch1
111Rising, theTregillis1
112Root of UnityHuang1
113Saint OddKoontz1
114Sceptre of Morgulan, theRyan1
115Shadows of SelfSanderson1
116Shrivers: The Substrate War 3Kinnison1
117Signal to NoiseMoreno-Garcia1
118Skull of OghrenVainio1
119Skull Throne, theBrett1
120SousmissionHoulledeq1
121Straits of HellAnderson1
122Sword of ArelionGreen1
123Twice and Future Caeser: A Novel of the USS MerrimackMeluch1
124Vorrh, theCatling1
125War DogsBear1
126Watchmaker of Filigree Street, thePulley1
127Water Knife, theBacigalupi1
128Welcome to Night ValeCranor/Fink1
129Whispering Swarm, theMoorcock1
130Wolf by WolfGraudin1
131Yaqteenya, the Old WorldBahjatt1
132Zero WorldHough1

 

 

TITLEAUTHOR(S)NOMINATIONS
1636: The Cardinal VirtuesFlint/Hunt3
A Succession of Bad DaysSaunders1
Aeronaut’s Windlass, theButcher19
Alex Crow, theSmith1
AliceHenry1
Ancillary MercyLeckie7
Ancillary SwordLeckie2
Angels of AttackKloos2
Anniversary Day SagaRusch2
ArchangelReed2
Architect of AeonsWright1
ArmadaKline1
Ashes BornLowell1
AuroraRobinson5
Autumn Republic, theMcClellan2
Awesome, theDarrows1
Black Fleet TrilogyDalzelle2
Black WolvesElliott3
BlackbirdBoykin3
Bones and AllDe Angelis2
Book of Lost Doors, theBurnett1
Borrowed Man, AWolfe1
Buried Giant, theIshiguro1
Byrony and RosesKingfisher1
Call To Arms, AZahn/Pope/Weber2
Castaway PlanetSpoor/Flint1
Cat at Bay, ABoykin1
ChaplewoodPriest1
Children of TimeTchaikovsky2
Cinder Spires, theButcher1
Clockwork LivesAnderson1
Collisions of the DamnedYoung2
Culmanic PartsSutcliffe1
Cunning BloodDuntemann1
Dark Forest, theLiu3
Dark IntelligenceAsher1
Dark OrbitGilman1
Dark Tide Rising SeriesRingo4
Darker Shade of Magic, ASchwab2
Desert and the Blade, theStirling6
Devil’s Only Friend, theWells5
Dinosaur LordsMilan1
Discworld SeriesPratchett4
DistopiaKroese2
Dragon ThiefSwann2
Dread Wyrm, theCameron1
Echopes of ApolloThompson1
Edge of DarkCooper1
Fifth Season, theJemsin8
FirefightSanderson4
FlexSteinmetz1
Fool’s QuestHobb3
Foxglove SummerAaronovitch2
Futuristic Violence and Fancy SuitsWong2
GatefatherCard1
Gentleman Joe and the Red QueenBujold1
Golden SonBrown5
Grace of KingsLiu1
Greek KeySpangler1
Half a WarAbercrombie1
Harry Potter and the Methods of RationalityYudlowsky5
Hell’s Foundation QuiverWeber4
Her Brother’s KeeperKupari2
Hidden Masters of Marandur and the Assassins of AltisCampbell1
Honor At StakeFinn22
House of Shattered Wings, thede Bodard2
IlluminaeKaufman1
Invisiblew Library, theCogman1
Just City, theWalton7
Karen MemoryBear1
Knight’s Shadowde Castelle1
Last Song Before NightMyer11
Less Than HeroBrowne1
Liar’s Key, theLawrence1
Library at Mount Char, theHawkins2
Life and DeathMeyer1
Long Time Until Now, AWilliamson16
Long Way to a Small, Angry PlanetChambers1
Lost Fleet: Beyond the Frontier: LeviathanCampbell1
Mechanical, theTregellis2
Mind Over AllFabian1
MorteRepino1
Nemesis GamesCorey3
Net of Dawn and Bones, AChancy4
NetherealNeimeier13
Oncoming Storm, theNuttall1
One Year AfterForstchen1
OracleWest1
OriginatorShepherd1
PactWildbow1
Philosopher Kings, theWalton1
Predator OneMayberry1
Providence of Fire, theStaveley1
RadianceValente1
RadiomenLerman1
Raising CaineGannon5
Retrieval Artist seriesRusch1
Rising, theTregillis1
Ronin GamesHarmon4
Root of UnityHuang1
Saint OddKoontz1
Saturn RunSandford/Ctein6
Sceptre of Morgulan, theRyan1
SevenevesStephenson15
Shadows of SelfSanderson1
Shepherd’s Crown, thePratchett3
Shrivers: The Substrate War 3Kinnison1
Signal to NoiseMoreno-Garcia1
Skull of OghrenVainio1
Skull Throne, theBrett1
SomewitherWright23
Son of the Black Sword, theCorreia11
Sorcerer to the CrownCho4
SousmissionHoulledeq1
Straits of HellAnderson1
Strands of SorrowRingo8
Sword of ArelionGreen1
TorchshipGallagher3
Traitor Baru Cormorant, theDickinson2
Twice and Future Caeser: A Novel of the USS MerrimackMeluch1
UprootedNovik19
VermillionTanzer2
Vorrh, theCatling1
War DogsBear1
Watchmaker of Filigree Street, thePulley1
Water Knife, theBacigalupi1
Welcome to Night ValeCranor/Fink1
Werewolf CopKlavan2
Whispering Swarm, theMoorcock1
Wolf by WolfGraudin1
Yaqteenya, the Old WorldBahjatt1
Zero WorldHough1

 

ETA (3/9/2016): Unranked, “recommendation list-like” version.  (Alphabetical by title)

TITLEAUTHOR(S)NOMINATIONS
1636: The Cardinal VirtuesFlint/Hunt3
Aeronaut’s Windlass, theButcher19
Alex Crow, theSmith1
AliceHenry1
Ancillary MercyLeckie7
Ancillary SwordLeckie2
Angels of AttackKloos2
Anniversary Day SagaRusch2
ArchangelReed2
Architect of AeonsWright1
ArmadaKline1
Ashes BornLowell1
AuroraRobinson5
Autumn Republic, theMcClellan2
Awesome, theDarrows1
Black Fleet TrilogyDalzelle2
Black WolvesElliott3
BlackbirdBoykin3
Bones and AllDe Angelis2
Book of Lost Doors, theBurnett1
Borrowed Man, AWolfe1
Buried Giant, theIshiguro1
Byrony and RosesKingfisher1
Call To Arms, AZahn/Pope/Weber2
Castaway PlanetSpoor/Flint1
Cat at Bay, ABoykin1
ChaplewoodPriest1
Children of TimeTchaikovsky2
Cinder Spires, theButcher1
Clockwork LivesAnderson1
Collisions of the DamnedYoung2
Culmanic PartsSutcliffe1
Cunning BloodDuntemann1
Dark Forest, theLiu3
Dark IntelligenceAsher1
Dark OrbitGilman1
Dark Tide Rising SeriesRingo4
Darker Shade of Magic, ASchwab2
Desert and the Blade, theStirling6
Devil’s Only Friend, theWells5
Dinosaur LordsMilan1
Discworld SeriesPratchett4
DistopiaKroese2
Dragon ThiefSwann2
Dread Wyrm, theCameron1
Echopes of ApolloThompson1
Edge of DarkCooper1
Fifth Season, theJemsin8
FirefightSanderson4
FlexSteinmetz1
Fool’s QuestHobb3
Foxglove SummerAaronovitch2
Futuristic Violence and Fancy SuitsWong2
GatefatherCard1
Gentleman Joe and the Red QueenBujold1
Golden SonBrown5
Grace of KingsLiu1
Greek KeySpangler1
Half a WarAbercrombie1
Harry Potter and the Methods of RationalityYudlowsky5
Hell’s Foundation QuiverWeber4
Her Brother’s KeeperKupari2
Hidden Masters of Marandur and the Assassins of AltisCampbell1
Honor At StakeFinn22
House of Shattered Wings, thede Bodard2
IlluminaeKaufman1
Invisiblew Library, theCogman1
Just City, theWalton7
Karen MemoryBear1
Knight’s Shadowde Castelle1
Last Song Before NightMyer11
Less Than HeroBrowne1
Liar’s Key, theLawrence1
Library at Mount Char, theHawkins2
Life and DeathMeyer1
Long Time Until Now, AWilliamson16
Long Way to a Small, Angry PlanetChambers1
Lost Fleet: Beyond the Frontier: LeviathanCampbell1
Mechanical, theTregellis2
Mind Over AllFabian1
MorteRepino1
Nemesis GamesCorey3
Net of Dawn and Bones, AChancy4
NetherealNeimeier13
Oncoming Storm, theNuttall1
One Year AfterForstchen1
OracleWest1
OriginatorShepherd1
PactWildbow1
Philosopher Kings, theWalton1
Predator OneMayberry1
Providence of Fire, theStaveley1
RadianceValente1
RadiomenLerman1
Raising CaineGannon5
Retrieval Artist seriesRusch1
Rising, theTregillis1
Ronin GamesHarmon4
Root of UnityHuang1
Saint OddKoontz1
Saturn RunSandford/Ctein6
Sceptre of Morgulan, theRyan1
SevenevesStephenson15
Shadows of SelfSanderson1
Shepherd’s Crown, thePratchett3
Shrivers: The Substrate War 3Kinnison1
Signal to NoiseMoreno-Garcia1
Skull of OghrenVainio1
Skull Throne, theBrett1
SomewitherWright23
Son of the Black Sword, theCorreia11
Sorcerer to the CrownCho4
SousmissionHoulledeq1
Straits of HellAnderson1
Strands of SorrowRingo8
Succession of Bad Days, ASaunders1
Sword of ArelionGreen1
TorchshipGallagher3
Traitor Baru Cormorant, theDickinson2
Twice and Future Caeser: A Novel of the USS MerrimackMeluch1
UprootedNovik19
VermillionTanzer2
Vorrh, theCatling1
War DogsBear1
Watchmaker of Filigree Street, thePulley1
Water Knife, theBacigalupi1
Welcome to Night ValeCranor/Fink1
Werewolf CopKlavan2
Whispering Swarm, theMoorcock1
Wolf by WolfGraudin1
Yaqteenya, the Old WorldBahjatt1
Zero WorldHough1
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14 Comments

    1. Thanks. Maybe it will help some people see the difference. I think the animosity would go way down on a list looking like the 2nd.

      From your post 7 levels of recommending:
      1. First list is R7
      2. Second list is R4

      That’s a pretty big jump. Would you agree with my reclassification? To make it really help the list should be compiled as suggestions are made and links to the post with the list should be shared regularly 1-3 months before nominations end.

  1. Tasha: I pretty well explained the methodology – but don’t mind people pointing out things and/or providing additional information.

    Of course, none of this would be necessary or even interesting to do if the slate had been a recommendation list: months ago people could have started reading recommendations that interested them.

    What you say is true but this wasn’t a win/lose situation: I took a few minutes to demonstrate that the Fannish thing to do is pitch in and help out; that information such as this should be freely shared without attached bias; to get an indication of where things might be going after March; that impatient individuals (or those who actually like to read the things they might nominate) could do for themselves without having to organize a political party to do so; to illustrate some points; to satisfy curiosity; to…….

    1. I would have left the ranking off, put the list in alphabetical order, still included the column with how many recommend. That would show how you could take what they were creating and turn it into a recommendation list as many clubs and organizations do this.

      People participating on the SP4 website have been able to read recommended books. We don’t know how many lurkers have been on the site reading but not commenting.

      SP4 Website stats of interest from google analytics and WordPress separately:
      1. Number of unique visitors & # return visitors
      2. Number of pages visited by typical visitor
      3. Length of time for typical page visited
      4. Top 10 pages visited & their stats (# unique visitors, average length of visit, # return visitors)

  2. No “good dead” goes unpunished. I see your being critiqued for compiling the entries exactly as they were made instead of cleaning them up. As well as for the items on the list. The comments on File 770 were to be expected. Some days you can’t win.

  3. Ringo’s Strands of Sorrow and Ringo’s Dark Tide series is really the same entry since he only released on eligible work in that universe this year – which is SoS – yielding 12 votes total.

      1. He has been nominated before. However, since he belongs to a Hugo-outgroup, he would never win a Hugo. He will, however, continue to merrily sell scads of books.

        Quick nod to the compiler, Steve D., for the early list of named recommendations and their votes.

        1. Basically, Kate’s going to have the “official” one compiled in the next day or so.

          Re: scads of books, I picked up the anthology he edited in EARC form, Friday.

          John has in recent years said a few rude things about WorldCon. Likewise, MadMike voted Noah Ward on every nomination last summer, including his own.

          1. Dex, saying rude things about Worldcon will not and can not affect how nominations for his works are handled.

            RE the above “Hugo ‘outgroup'”; believe what you want, but there ain’t no such thing. There are works that a majority settle on, eventually, and there are works that they don’t.

            Continuing to view this process as a game of high school clicks does no one any good service.

          2. It’s a hint as to how John might react to being nominated. Larry Correia and Brad Torgerson, for example, have said that they will never accept another Hugo nomination.

            I asked MadMike about nominating “A Long Time Until Now”. He replied, “My reaction will depend on Worldcon’s, if it happens.” He did vote Noah on his entire ballot last year.

        2. Rat Seal,

          sales do not impact nor should they have any bearing whatsoever on the awards, nomination considerations or even discussion on the subject.

  4. “Ancillary Sword” isn’t eligible. It was nominated, and didn’t go anywhere, last year, mainly because it stunk. As it turns out, it was a case of Two Towers Syndrome — middle volume of a trilogy frequently has a lot of side-story and little action.

    “Ancillary Mercy” is eligible. While Leckie did manage to pull out a credible ending for the trilogy, there’s a bunch of stuff that I’d put higher on the list.

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